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Thread Admin: Bubba J (58-0-0) (Last 10 Posts) Posted: 10/13/2008 at 18:13:08
Total Posts: 17
Thread Title: "How long to keep 4473 forms - post #2"
Bubba J I do not seem to be able to locate the original thread involving this topic so I am starting this thread in order to ask a question. As I recall, there were a number of posters on the original thread who strongly supported destroying these forms as current BATFE rules & regs allow after 20 years. I believe the main reason was to prevent the BATFE from keeping records of who purchased what when and where when the BATFE either came to do an audit or when an out of business operation sent the required information to them.

Having said this, here is my question. Realizing that the 4473 forms contain more detailed information about each firearm transaction, if they are destroyed after the current twenty year period, and if the BATFE either does an audit or receives the dealers' Bound Record Book at the end of business activity, isn't there enough information in the BRB to successfully complete the BATFEs' wishes/needs. I am referring to: Name; address; date of aquisition/disposition; type of firearm; serial number, etc. True, the BRB may not contain the physical description of the buyer as well as their Social Security number, etc., but doesn't the BRC contain enough to satisfy the needs of BATFE? Or is it permissible to delete the BRB information after the 20 year period? Just food for consideration.

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Seller: WILLIE TA(1375-0-1) Post#1 - Posted: 10/13/2008 at 20:49:48
WILLIE TA YES ITS 20 YEARS. BUT EVEN AFTER THE 4473 FORMS ARE GONE REMEMBER THERE IS THE RECORD BOOKS SO ITS NOT GONE FOREVER...

Thread Admin: Bubba J(58-0-0) Post#2 - Posted: 10/14/2008 at 07:36:40
Bubba J WILLIE TA: Thanks for your input. This is the exact point that I was attempting to make. Other than having a bit more information available on the 20 year old plus 4473 forms, I feel that the core information will always be in the BRB for BATFE to examine at any time that they choose. So why be overly concerned in the destruction of them? Just soliciting opinions, that is all.

FR&G

Former Seller: Joes Custom Guns(358-2-2) Post#3 - Posted: 10/14/2008 at 09:00:55
(no avatar) Why not start a new book ea. yr. and put the 4473's with them,Then at the end of 20yrs let them all go togather

Thread Admin: Bubba J(58-0-0) Post#4 - Posted: 10/14/2008 at 10:53:58
Bubba J Joes Custom Guns: I don't think that a FFL dealer can destroy any BRB or its' contents can they? The 4473 forms may be destroyed after they are 20 tears old, but the BRB can not. It must either remain in the dealers possession or be sent to BATFE at the end of business for that dealler. Am I wrong here??

FR&G

Seller: Hartwell Gun(976-1-2) Post#5 - Posted: 10/14/2008 at 13:30:52
Hartwell Gun FFG-100% correct.ALL A&D books have to be sent/

Thread Admin: Bubba J(58-0-0) Post#6 - Posted: 10/14/2008 at 16:07:26
Bubba J Then this causes me to wonder why all of the concern in keeping the 20+ year old 4473 forms? I would think that BATFE has all the information that they deem important in the BRB. Maybe not all the info that is requested to complete an in depth trace, but enough indeed to establish some type of tracking system of firearms that are sold. Just curious, that's all.

FR&G

Seller: Hartwell Gun(977-1-2) Post#7 - Posted: 10/14/2008 at 16:42:51
Hartwell Gun FFG/they refer to this as unfounded paranoia "at this time".Many(in the free states) buy a firearm,trade it,sell them,get bored with it,buy it from individuals,ect.It is near impossible to follow older firearms path from birth,a little easier from a crime scene back,that's even hard to do.Down the road may be a different story on new firearms,if everybody went by rules used by MA,CA,NJ,and the like,then they will be more traceable,but still will not be able to find most of the older ones previously owned.JMHO

Seller: kats(463-0-0) Post#8 - Posted: 10/15/2008 at 07:36:43
(no avatar) FR&G - the bound book only contains the buyers name - and the description of the firearms. Does not show the buyers address - it also shows the # assigned to the 4473 & date of the transaction.

The bound books does show the name and address of where the item came from - where we purchased it.

I started the original thread about 4473 retention in the 'gun talk' category.

Thread Admin: Bubba J(58-0-0) Post#9 - Posted: 10/15/2008 at 10:56:16
Bubba J kats: The BRB that I keep has an areas for "Disposition Name" and "Disposition Address" listed. BATFE informed me that the address is to be included as well. I have done this since my first license was issued in 1987. Have I been told wrong here?

FR&G

Former Seller: Joes Custom Guns(358-2-2) Post#10 - Posted: 10/15/2008 at 12:30:25
(no avatar) Whats going to happen when we all change over to the CP book keeping? Are we still going to keep them for 20yrs. even if our DELL crashes

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